Thoughts on Narnia

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Thoughts on Narnia

Post by archonix » Wed Jan 11, 2006 1:27 pm

Right, so, this seems to be one of those films that creates an almost ideological divide between those that lilek it and those that don't. Pity the poor saps caught in the middle of the rift, who have to face the likes of me; you're either with me or your not. ;D

I saw this film a couple of days ago and I've been letting it digest in the back of my mind since then. At the time, I was impressed. I'm still impressed now. It was, I reckon, an excellent film, let down by a couple of bits of bad directing near the end...
Spoiler
Plot-wise it stuck to the book almost faithfully. There were a couple of dropped scenes that I would have liked to see and a few bits of dialogue that disappeared unnecessarily... but I think can forgive that.
Spoiler
In an overall view, I think we're a bit spoiled by Lord of the Rings. Over the course of that film we got no less than 6 battles, 3 of the epic variety, three less-so. In this we get one battle and a lot of tents, which doesn't have the same kind of immediate impact... but - and there's always a but - I think the actual battle was pulled off pretty well. There was a certain amount of apeing of LOTR in the way the scenes were directed - those grand-epic flying camera shots are going ot get as old and stale as Bullet-Time soon ;) - but the battle itself was a very different beast, and was pulles off very well. I'd even go as far as to say that the SFX in this were better than LOTR, overall. When I was watching that there were moments when I could see the metaphorical strings and plasticine orcs in between the flashes of brilliance. I couldn't see them as often in Narnia, which seemed to pull off a less variable level of quality; not quite as amazing as the best of LOTR, but altogether more consistent. And that's saying something.


Now, I've heard some complaints about the soundtrack, which I can understand., but don't necessarily agree with. Near the beginning of the film, when Peter, Susan, Edmuna and Lucy are travelling from London, their journey is overlaid with a very modern sounding piece of music. From people's descriptions I was expecting some sort of Bass-pounding celtic techno, but what we actually got was very emotive. You have to remember that, although this is ostensibly set in 1940s Britain, it's really a fantasy epic; putting in 1940s era shuffle or skiffle might have ruined the mood a little. Off the top of my head I can't think of any period music that could really have portrayed the sort of desolation of spirit that the evacuation would have caused. For me, it worked. But that's me. :)

Again, with the battle, the soundtrack surprised me a little. It wasn't the bombastic, triumphant and very hummable theme from LOTR but was, instead, a much more muted and understated affair. The way that it completely cut out at key points and let the whole gory mess speak for itself was good. My impression is that the composer was trying to portray a quiet, deseperate hopefulness tinged with a little bit of sadness that the world had been reduced to this level. It fit with what we were seeing. The hope of Aslan's return
Spoiler
, and the final, desperate last stand.

A very good movie and one I'll be adding to my DVD collection asap. :)
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Tigersrock144 » Wed Jan 11, 2006 4:37 pm

excellent review, sums up Narnia for me :) I acturally saw Narnia just before New Year.  The best part was anything with Aslan in it! I loved Aslan, I've always liked Aslan, he's my favioute character but I think it's pretty obvious why ;)
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Terry Y » Wed Jan 11, 2006 5:03 pm

Well, Graham, you certainly make some good arguments.  And I must say that I agree with some of what was said, but I still wasn't that impressed with this movie.

I think a lot of it had to do with the overall tone of the film.  There were just too many little things I found annoying.  Especially the kids' smarmy-ness.  Those kids (with the exception of Lucy, for the most part) came off as the most sarcastic brats ever.  The only one who comes off like that in the book is Edmund, which is fine, since it fits his character.  But for the entire first half of the movie, I remeber thinking to myself, "I don't want to root for the little punks!  Maybe a good butt-kicking would do them good!"  Thankfully, Aslan changed them all for the better and the second half of the film was infinitely better than the first
putting in 1940s era shuffle or skiffle might have ruined the mood a little. Off the top of my head I can't think of any period music that could really have portrayed the sort of desolation of spirit that the evacuation would have caused.
Here's where I think some original orchestal scoring would have worked better.  True, shuffle and skiffle would be too happy sounding for the mood. whereas some meloncholy strings would have worked perfectly.  I'm reminded of the end of "Gangs of New York" were a U2 song was played over the credits.  I thought it kind of ruined the setting, using a modern song in what was, essentially, a period movie.

Overall, I thought the strengths of the second half made up for the weakness of the first half.  But, man, that was a weak first half.  It could've been much better.  But, as we surely know, it could've been much, much worse.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Orange Box » Wed Jan 11, 2006 5:22 pm

Narnia was not bad, although I like the book better. One thing I do have to say though: Mr. Tumnus (the faun) was creepy as hell. A half-naked, paranoid, manipulative, blemish-covered man-goat abducting a little girl in the woods... Imo, that part was more than a little disturbing. :-\

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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by capadde » Wed Jan 11, 2006 6:44 pm

Weren't kids those days taught *not* to follow strange men home? Especially if they offered you tea and cookies? That should apply to man-goats too.

To sum it up, it was a decent movie. Mind you, I haven't read the books. I've listened to audio tapes and seen the cartoonized film, so I knew the plot well when I saw it.

I was impressed by how violent it got towards the end, with the battles and all.
Spoiler
I can't say the music score was exceptional, it was something that this movie lacked.

But it's a movie one should see. I was impressed at the time I got out of the theater, and I still think it was a great movie.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Sheana_Molloy » Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:00 pm

Ah, finally, somebody started a thread!

I agree with a lot of the points made already, my stance is somewhere between Graham's and Terry's.  It wasn't absolutely brilliant and flawless, and I've certainly been spoiled majorly by the likes of the LOTR films, but I did enjoy it a lot.  My favorite version of LW&W is still the animated one from the late '70s/early '80s that the UK made, but this one still has its merits.

A lot of the designs and CGs were quite good, those were some impressive centaur, satyrs and so on.  The Witch was quite fearsome in a lot of places, as was her magic.  I also liked the old-fashioned Father Christmas.

The CG was slightly spotty in places, though, particularly with animals like Mr. & Mrs. Beaver and Mr. Fox.  I admit, I found Susan and Peter not quite as likeable off the bat as they should have been, for a long time the only likeable/real/etc. kid was Lucy.  Lucy was quite cute in this movie.  Aslan was pretty neat, but not quite as epicly impressive as I imagined him to be, though.  He was just this sort of big lion that came and went.  Maybe it's just me, but a bit more background information and talk about him would've been helpful, and a bit more powerfully grand moments and acting. 
Spoiler
Mixed feelings about the music.  Some of the score I liked a lot, like the battle/main theme and the pan pipes, others I wasn't so sure about.  Some of the modern music was okay and it fitted, like 'Can't Take It In' at the end, but some of it just didn't work in my opinion.  Alanis Morrisette?  What the hell.

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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Terry Y » Wed Jan 11, 2006 8:59 pm

Orange Box wrote: Mr. Tumnus (the faun) was creepy as hell. A half-naked, paranoid, manipulative, blemish-covered man-goat abducting a little girl in the woods... Imo, that part was more than a little disturbing. :-\
Yeah, me too.  I half expected him to start whistling "In the Hall of the Mountain King" any second.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by tommy » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:36 am

I'm surprised no-one commented on the Christian undertones yet.
A review in my paper went into detail about the author of the book being an orthodox christian who wanted to spread the Word with his book - unlike his colleage and friend Tolkien, who apparently didn't have that much of a hidden ideological agenda.
And apparently the movie was partly financed and heavily promoted by right-wing christian groups in the US.
I got to say: this kept me from viewing it (that and the fact that the fantasy genre leaves me pretty much indifferent). So I didn't see it, and I'm not planning to either.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Sheana_Molloy » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:40 am

Well yeah, the fact that there's loads of Christian metaphors and allegories in the Narnia Chronicles is nothing new....that's been well-known for *decades*.

And as a matter of fact, they played down some of the religious parable aspects a bit, it's not quite as heavy-handed as the books.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by margefan » Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:17 am

tommy wrote: I'm surprised no-one commented on the Christian undertones yet.
A review in my paper went into detail about the author of the book being an orthodox christian who wanted to spread the Word with his book - unlike his colleage and friend Tolkien, who apparently didn't have that much of a hidden ideological agenda.
And apparently the movie was partly financed and heavily promoted by right-wing christian groups in the US.
I got to say: this kept me from viewing it (that and the fact that the fantasy genre leaves me pretty much indifferent). So I didn't see it, and I'm not planning to either.
I havent seen the film yet and Im not sure that I intend to but I agree with Tommy on this point.
Tolkien was a catholic yet must of his stuff was based on pagan mythology. There are gods, angels and spirits in his books but there is no hidden agenda in his books, simply the best values of humanity are highlighted and praised to contrast with the interpretation of evil. There are Christain values in there but not to the extent of preaching. Planting religious agenda's in childrens books seems pretty questionable to me.
This is pretty much the reason why my enthuisiasm for C.S.Lewis ends with a brief reading of the books some years ago and watching the mini series that used to be on the BBC on sunday evenings. Ahh to be a child again.... :D
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by c_nordlander » Thu Jan 12, 2006 10:57 am

Molloy the Catburglar wrote: Well yeah, the fact that there's loads of Christian metaphors and allegories in the Narnia Chronicles is nothing new....that's been well-known for *decades*.
Sheana said it.

"Lord of the Rings"=symbolism (of good vs. evil, of power corrupting, etc.).
"Chronicles of Narnia"=allegory.

EDIT: Well, *I* would call it an allegory, in some respects at least. Apparently C. S. Lewis himself didn't, and well, I defer to him.

That makes all the difference. And what some people seem to miss is that with allegory, if it's *good* allegory (which I would say "Narnia" is), the hidden message doesn't have to obtrude unless you want it to.

Personally, I have to say I'd prefer "Lord of the Rings" if I had to choose between the two, though that's probably because "Narnia" is, at the end of the day, a kids' series.

Anyway, my review of the film is pretty close to Graham's. I'll have to put myself in the "spoiled by LotR" camp as well, though on the other hand, this film avoided some of the traps the "Lord of the Rings" ones fell into. (Apart from the white-water rafting on the river, I didn't find any scenes that looked like they were only there to promote a computer game, for one thing.) Narnia was as gorgeous a sight as it was described in the books.

I haven't read "The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe" in many years, so I didn't notice many departures from the book. The film felt a bit condensed in places, though.

Good, nay *great*, acting. Particularly from the children, which can be tough. (I also found Peter and Susan a bit stodgy at the start, probably because they were the old and sensible ones, but they grew on me.) Lucy was adorable. The White Witch impressed me in all her majesty, evil and growing despair. Aslan was appropriately magnificent.

(Oh, and  I didn't find the kids smarmy, at least not more so than in the books. Spirited, perhaps.)

The CGI, to my untutored eyes, looked good. I can imagine the artists here had a somewhat even harder time than those working on the LotR films, since centaurs and fauns are a lot more engrained in the public conscious than elves and orcs. I could go into an editorial about this, I fear. It was a bit of a jolt seeing the lipsynched animals, but then, I guess it would be. Seeing all those different beasts and creatures was a joy. The battle was pretty great, though I do have a few complaints.
Spoiler
The soundtrack didn't impress me terribly, but it certainly wasn't bad. As Graham said, it was a bit more understated than you'd expect from a fantasy film, but this isn't a bad thing. (I won't go into the "celtic techno" debate.)

So, well, recommended. My rating: A

Oh, and I fully agree with Graham about Father Christmas.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by archonix » Thu Jan 12, 2006 1:52 pm

Hm. I don't agree with the idea that CS Lewis was planting a religious agenda of any kind. He wrote a fantasy story, based on his world view, just as anyone else bases what they write on their world view. Lewis himself said it wasn't an allegory; in his letters to various people who explained that the story was an exercise in trying to see how the christian story would happen in a different world. It's a mythology based on christian ideas, a fantasy interpretation of how the christian story might have played out in a fantasy world, but not an allegory. It wasn't written as a preaching pulpit either, except in teh sens that all books are written with the prejudices of the author in the fore. It was a children's story. Those children that see the message in the story and think about it are the smart ones anyway, and capable of making their own choices, so what's the problem?

Also, I certainly doubt that Disney would allow "right wing" christian groups - as if being right wing was a bad thing? - to fund their movie, considering their usual contempt for said groups. That's just rumour and hearsay. ;) And so what if they promote it? Is that any different to Friends of the Earth and Greenpeace promoting The Day After Tomorrow?
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by Sheana_Molloy » Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:26 pm

Ahh, some very good points brought up, Graham.  That actually does clear a few things up.

Most of the soundtrack I thought was alright/so-so and such, but the main theme/big battle song and the pan pipes song are starting to grow on me very very much...
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by archonix » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:51 pm

Interesting tidbit: the Narnian Lulaby Mr Tumnus plays is almost identical to the version played in the BBC miniseries.
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Re: Thoughts on Narnia

Post by tommy » Thu Jan 12, 2006 10:07 pm

Hm... I saw a few clips with Tilda Swinton in it, and she looks and acts terrific. I guess if I ever get bored enough to view this thing I'll go rooting for her character, instead of that mouth-synched lion... but I guess that's not exactly the intention of the makers.
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